Dermot Crowley Ógra Shinn Féin
West Tyrone
Irish Republicanism and Feminism are two sides of the one coin.
Too many confuse, stereotype and misrepresent feminists as skin head, bra burning, socialist worker selling, men hating women.
While all of the above are absolutely anyone's right, it most certainly does not define feminism.
Allowing a tiny minority of people to misrepresent feminism is much the same as allowing the current dolly mixture of anti GFA groups, to claim the title of republicanism.
You would never allow the anti GFA head bangers purport to be the true voice of republicanism and neither should you allow a small group, a minority of man haters to misrepresent or lay claim to feminism.
Feminism in its purist definition is absolute equality of the sexes. Sin é!
If you don't agree with that, then you ain't a republican, despite how many 'Brits out' you shout or rebel songs you sing.
And why is it important to distinguish yourself as a feminist as opposed to some broad term of 'egalitarian'?
Simply because the huge, institutionalised and generational enforced inequalities against women must be prioritised in it's own right, with a sole and passionate focus to put it right once and for all.
Lumping it in with all the other equality issues is prolonging the problem, and doing the inequality of women and every other issue of inequality a disservice.
Of course there has been strides taken in the past century in gender equality, a tribute to the Trojan work of feminists across the world, but there are still massive steps to take before we end the patriarchal system which has resigned women to second class citizenship for too long.
That is the job of the feminists for the 21st Century, male and female feminists coming together in a strong symbol of solidarity and equality in forging a new future for future generations.
Ógra Shinn Féin is an explicitly proud feminist organisation, and will continue to pursue a vigorous campaign to increase the number of active young women republicans and create a welcoming and open environment in the party which young women can join and let their voices be heard.
We are also committed to playing a progressive role in changing society, so that more and more young women are able to achieve all that they want to achieve and be what they want to be.
If you believe in equality for men and women, then you are a feminist.
Be a proud unrepentant feminist bastard!
28 comments:
very true on the feminism statements but u cant link those who are anti gfa with those who are anti peace process there are a minority who believe in this way and in my opionion are as daft as those who support the gfa/
st andrews/hillsborough/aggrements
As an explicitly proud feminist organisation Ógra should be actively campaigning - both within the broader party and in society - to change the policies that deny women our essential and fundamental right to make our own reproductive choices. But I have never seen Ógra do this, despite having passed a pro-choice motion a few years ago. Ógra's feminist credentials cannot be fully believed as long as it continues to shy away from the issue as a campaigning issue.
Wednesday is assuming that the right to aborption is a women's choice and therfore a feminist issue but that is something that is not accepted by every-one. Ógra focus on issues based around equality such as pay, jobs, equal rights etc.
Is it up for debate whether the right to abortion is indeed a equality issue.
Couldn't have said it better myself Wednesday....
Blogposts on feminism and the sporadic nod to International Womens Day are a good gesture, but mean very little until pro-choice campaigns are actually initiated by OSF.
Green Postbox campaigns are of little use to the thousands of Irish women, from north and south, who have to leave the island every year to exercise their right to choose.
Insightful article, but Wednesday has raised an important issue. I would argue that feminism is not decided on whether you are pro choice or not.
Just on that Wednesday have you or any other pro choice comrades 'campaigned' within the party on pro choice, cause if you have I sure as hell haven't heard about it.
Are you perhaps looking Ogra to do your bidding for you?
Charlie
Get out of the office and down from that ivory tower stephie.
So now feminist credentials is solely based on how much pro choice campaigning you do? Come of it.
Are you perhaps the very same stereotype that alienates many genuine activists from feminism with your extreme purist elitist manner? GL
I like the series of articles for International Women's Day, and would like to see more visable campaigning on feminist issues from ogra. Nice graphic ;)
Ógra is not one dimentional, and we are certainly not a lobbying group for pro-choice campaigners.
I as a feminist pro life member would not be a member of ogra shinnféin if it were pro abortion, keep up the good work comrades,Women were babies too.
Charlie – I have campaigned within the party, unfortunately I have neither the time nor inclination to send out newsletters on whatever I seek change on. When I was in Ogra I campaigned there too. Myself and other pro-choice comrades lost many a motion within Ogra. That’s party democracy. I can only commend the membership of Ogra who passed the pro-choice motion. All I’m saying is, Ogra are progressive in that they have a pro-choice mandate, and it’s a very real issue affecting thousands of people – it would be great to see a campaign on it.
GL – Feminism is about equality for women. If you do not believe in a woman’s right to control her own reproduction, then you are not a feminist. I’m just not sure how helpful it is to feminism – a cause Ogra now hold so dear – to have a pro-choice mandate and not campaign on it. It’s hardly elitist or alienating.
And remember kids, never, EVER burn a bra near ivory. It’s flammable. Right I'm away off to shave my head, I didn't realise I'd have to hand back my membership card to feminist club if I didn't conform to a stereotype....
Stephie you are the one who is presenting a stero-type, to be a feminist doesn't mean you are pro-choice!
It is up to that individual to decide.
In the interests of a more open comradely and constructive debate could anyone leaving a comment use their full name or first name and area. Thanks
Ok firstly I don’t see how I’m presenting a stereotype. For the record I have neither a shaved head nor a tendency to burn underwear at regular intervals, or hate men. In fact I quite like men, but I digress ;)
I believe that feminists as a group are not homogenous. I understand that there are people out there who identify as feminists when they are anti-choice. However, a woman’s right to choose if or when she will have children is a core feminist belief. I advocate a woman’s right to choose. As in, that’s *her* right. Not yours, or mine, or anyone else’s. I don’t believe that the anti-choice belief that a woman cannot make that decision for herself sits with the ideas of feminism.
For me, saying you are a feminist but are anti-choice is kind of like saying “I’m a Republican but I vote DUP”. As in, a complete contradiction in terms.
Brillian Article Barry... i know between yourself and Gemma this past year, you have certainly changed my opinion on feminism, using these very articles.
Laura.
Stephie does part of your choice not include the man who may be a feminist for which part of his bodys bloodline is in the genes of the child who my live to be a feminist also, choose life Sinead.
Anonymous, yes I have campaigned within the party for a change in the policy. I'm not in Ógra, though, so there's not much I can do to change Ógra's conduct on this issue.
While there may be people who consider themselves feminist and oppose legalised abortion, by doing so they are in fact working to an anti-feminist agenda. There can be no gender equality when the state can compel women to surrender control of their wombs during pregnancy. There is also a very significant issue of class equality due to the hypocritical Irish position which allows women to travel to end unwanted pregnancies if they have the resources to do so, while those without resources do not have this option.
Feminism as a movement is not divided on this issue. As a long-time feminist activist I can state that without question. I can also state that if Ógra or indeed SF as a whole were to stand in front of a feminist gathering and proclaim itself a feminist organisation it would be laughed out the room because of its cowardice on this issue. Until it recognises the centrality of reproductive rights to feminism it is not and will not be considered an ally by the feminist movement.
I presume you are asking me if I believe that a man should have a choice or a veto over whether or not a woman continues a pregnancy. In a word – no. It’s a woman’s choice and hers alone. If she wants to involve a man in her decision making process, that’s up to her. But no, regardless of “bloodlines” and “genes”, no one should get to make that decision for a woman. A man who was a feminist would believe the same thing.
Genuine question to the pro choice comrades from an undecided mind;
A women can't produce without a man and vice versatile, so why the priority status given to women in having the absolute decree in deciding whether or not too abort? Is that not preaching inequality, resigning men too nothing more than servicemen, with little rights or entitlements over his possible children in regards whether they should live or not?
Is feminism not about equality of the sexes?
Charlie
Also forgot to mention for two people involved in the party, and supposedly so passionate about pro choice, you have just give broad sweeping statements that you'd where active? Like what? Cause as I said I ain't heard anything.
I attend all Ard Fheis, read An Phoblacht weekly and have never heard mention of any work or lobbying by anyone on pro choice. Perhaps you are hitting out at Ogra on your own collective failings, and the elitist and condesending manner on which you commented would hardly inspire unity. If I as an older activist can see that, kids this, green post boxes that, I can just imagine what ogra comrades would think.
Maybe the reason pro choice campaigning in the party has floundered so far in the party is because of your attitudes, hardly endearing to say the least.
Charlie
Good to see a bit of debate comrades, but uncomradely or snide comments are unwelcome, and unhelpful.
Please debate in a sensible manner.
Donnchadh
“Charlie” – It isn’t about “resigning men to nothing more than servicemen” at all. It’s about giving those who have the reproductive responsibility, the reproductive rights. I prioritise the rights of those who are living over those who are not, and I believe in a person having agency over their own body – I don’t think that agency should extend to anybody else’s.
You’ll just have to take my word that I’ve been active in the part. I didn’t realise activism only counted if it got a mention in APRN. By the way, I have had some items in the paper but they were under a pen name as I wrote a column in the paper as well at the time. I’ve been on the Steering Committee for the Ard Fheis for a number of years now which prevents me from speaking on motions.
There’s nothing elitest about being pro-choice, and I made the “kids” comment after being accused of being a stereotype. I don’t *really* think I need to hand out advice to Ogra members on the flammability of ivory. It’s not my problem if you can’t identify sarcasm. I stand by my remark on the value of painting post-boxes green though....
Interesting article, even more interesting debate :)
More of these type of articles please to provoke debate, it has been lacking on the blog lately.
Young at Heart
just as a man i would like to say that i wouldent go near a woman who believed in abortion for dear life peter
On the reason men don't have an equal say on abortion, it's simply because they don't have an equal interest in it. Pregnancy and childbirth are not merely about the little person that comes out at the end of the nine months (if the pregnancy is proceeded with). They may seem that way to a man but that's precisely because men don't have to deal with many of the consequences of pregnancy that women have to deal with. It has a profound, and extremely disruptive, effect on a woman's life - physically, psychologically and economically. While men are also affected, the impact on them is orders of magnitude different from the impact on women. So it would be all out of proportion to their interest to assign them an equal say in the decision.
You also need to keep in mind that we're talking about a decision that can go only one of two ways - to abort or not to abort. If the parties disagree on this decision, then compelling her to abide by his preference isn't facilitating equality, it's giving him veto power. The same veto power men have traditionally held over women's lives.
As for my activism on the issue I've raised it at cumann and Cúige meetings, drafted motions for the Ard Fheis and Coiste Seasta, written to the Ard Rúnaí and An Phoblacht as well as numerous pieces on my own blog back when I was still keeping it up. Sorry if that's not enough for you. But I don't really see what it has to do with Ógra's refusal to campaign on a policy it's already adopted.
Women suffer the most physcial pain to a point the child suffers the most and both the mother and father involved are both emotionaly hurt no winner your right no to abortion and more sex education everywere in Ireland.
ógra doesnt have the ability to campaign on a pro choice agenda stephanie. The mandate supposedly given and I remember the motion well was not so strongly worded to do this and to be honest would most likely be defeated at any congress. But I do believe we need clearing up on this and I plan to have a pro choice motion at the next congress, if it is passed with an actual reasoned debate unlike last time then we will have a mandate but if not it will simply state what has been true for all these years despite that motion, ógra is not in favour of legalising abortion.
Hi Oisin,
I disagree that Ogra doesn’t have the ability to campaign on a pro-choice agenda – I’d argue that it’s more of a straight-up unwillingness. The motion that was passed wasn’t perfect, but the fact is that it was passed and gave a pro-choice mandate and there hasn’t been any change since then.
From a pro-choice perspective, I’m not sure of the value in bringing another pro-choice motion to congress. The position already exists. Unless it’s to mandate OSF to campaign actively on the issue. Unfortunately I wasn’t at the Congress where it was passed initially so I don’t know the circumstances of the debate but I like to think that all of Ogra’s debates are reasoned ;)
To the last anonymous poster, punctuation is your friend! I had to read your post several times before it was clear what you were trying to say.
On the issue of pain, there is none to the embryo if the abortion is carried out in the early stages because it isn't sufficiently developed to feel pain. There actually is no scientific consensus as to when, if ever, a foetus can feel pain. But if it is the case that at some stage they do feel pain then the Irish laws actually promote foetal pain by delaying abortion. When women's access to abortion is hindered but not totally blocked, as is the case in Ireland, the consequence is that they still have abortions but they have them later. This is borne out by British statistics showing that Irish women are more likely than British women to have late abortions.
As to emotional pain, there is always some with an unwanted pregnancy (or a pregnancy that was wanted but then something went wrong). Compelling a woman to continue a pregnancy against her will only makes this worse.
I agree that we need more sex education. It's a disgrace that schools can use the excuse of their "ethos" to opt out of certain aspects of the RSE curriculum, and is yet another reason why the public school system should be secularised (although that's a post for another day). We need a more open and honest approach to sexuality, OTC access to the morning after pill (this is already party policy - one of my motions, Charlie!) and greater encouragement of young women to have the courage and self-esteem to take control of their lives. We also need to address the drinking culture as this is undoubtedly responsible for a lot of crisis pregnancies. We should look as a model to the achievements of the Netherlands, where teens start having sex later, are less likely to get pregnant AND the abortion rate is one of the lowest in the world despite it being freely available there.
Oisín I don't understand your post. Ógra's abortion policy is pro-choice, as per that motion, so how can it be that Ógra isn't in favour of legalising abortion?
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